LWBC in Michigan

[NM8R]

Reviewing the tapes right now, from last night. It's always interesting to see what was captured.

Around 03Z it was all '70's hour, on Algeria 252.  What an odd mix of mx, too.  I'm guessing they did NOT get the Program Director from WCFL or WABC of that same era.  Or the Big 8.  Bonus points if you can tell me what station that was. 

Morocco on 171 corrected the mistake of their LW neighbor, and got some traditional AA mx on the turntable, around that same time.   Their signal also peaked and held nicely. 

Other participants:

183 Europa 1 (vy weak)
198 BBC 4 (just weak voices under powerhouse NDB DIW)

What did you guys hear?

Scott

[pinto vortando]

Too much RFI/EMI hr in the evening.  Have to do my LW listening in the early morning hours when the QRM goes away.

Anyway, "The Big 8" would be CKLW AM 800 late 60s. 
Bonus points if you can tell me what the Drake Format was.   

[NM8R]

You're a Detroit'er, right?   You smoked that question.

Drake Format - I do not know.   Standing by.

And LWBC conditions tonight stink.  Presume the geomagnetic storm is taking its toll on the TA path.  It seems to be making a mess out of 40 meters, as well.

[pinto vortando]

LW also in bad shape hr tonight.  The local QRM along with  K Index of 5 making for poor conditions.

yup,  Detroiter.

The Drake Format was CKLWs answer to WKNR.  WKNR 1310, aka Keener 13, suddenly appeared in late  1963 and quickly eclipsed the three other  metro Detroit top 40 rockers (CKLW 800 actually in Windsor Ontario, WXYZ 1270, WJBK 1500) with a lowly signal that barely reached the east side of Detroit from its transmitter site south of Dearborn.  CKLW hired West Coast programming consultant Bill Drake to tighten up their format and regain the position of the top rocker.  An interesting story if you care to research it but even more interesting to have been part of it.  Those were the glory days of AM radio. 

[pinto vortando]

Scott

LW conditions somewhat better hr this evening.  Hearing NDB 253 DD Columbus OH on 252 but no LWBC. 

How about up ur way?

[NM8R]

P.V.,

Very interesting on the Drake format.  CKLW was an incredible station.  It sounds like you may have been a part of it.  I'd like to hear more if you are inclined.

Can any fellow Michiganders verify what my ears are discerning?

When I listen to 252 Algeria I often hear two NDB's banging away and they both have the identifier of "MB".  I know about Manistee airport, but when I looked it up on:

http://www.dxinfocentre.com/ndb.htm
 
it shows loggings for the call MB at both Manistee and MBS airports.   

So the FAA actually was dunderheaded enough to assign the same identifier to two airports within radio range of each other in the same state?    Audible here, day and night.

Scott

[NM8R]

And LW conditions have been poor last few nights, thus no loggings from Up North...

[NM8R]

LW update:  fair to good signals from 252, presumed Algeria, with TexMex/Ranchero music.  I did not know that format resonated in the Mediterranean.  (0155Z).  Nil all other LW channels.  And before I hit post, they took a fade.

[pinto vortando]

Scott,

Yes, identifier MB is assigned to both beacons.  254 MB is the outer marker locator (LOM) for ILS/LOC RWY 28 @ Manistee Co. Blacker MBL.  257 MB is the LOM for ILS/LOC RWY 5 @ Saginaw/MBS (actually in Freeland and formerly known as "Tri-City").  Both beacons are +/- 1020 cycles so if you are using a narrow enough filter in SSB or CW mode they will be heard by that amount above and below the carrier frequency.  So, in other words, you may hear Manistee at 255.02 and Saginaw at 255.98.    Oh, and they both have an ID period of 6 seconds. (please note, some NDBs only use one sideband and the Canadians use 400 cycle modulation not 1020) Confused yet?  

In the AM mode, your receiver would probably hear the beacon ID on the carrier frequency.  So assuming you are listening to Algeria on 252 in AM mode and your radio has a wide AM filter, you may (from your location 60 mi to MBL and 90 mi to MBS) hear Algeria and Manistee and Saginaw simultaneously.  My guess is that this is what your ears are hearing.  Things only start to get really sticky if you switch in a narrow enough filter and the beacons begin to appear at two locations.  

As far as the CKLW thing is concerned, my involvement was only tangential.  Did get an insite though on the inner workings of the station.  Could go on all night about broadcast station operation but don't want to bore you or get way off topic.  It was a fun time in AM radio.  

If you have any more questions or my rambling response needs clarification, just ask.  73, PV

[pinto vortando]

Just some further comment as to the wisdom (?) of assigning the same identifier to 2 beacons so close together in frequency and geographically (110 mi).  

Today with most pilots not using their LW/MW Automatic Direction Finder  (ADF) all that much since everything is becoming GPS based along with the fact that all modern ADFs are digitally tuned and considering that the purpose of an outer marker locator LOM is for close-in short range navigation, say less than 25 mi, so as to find the outer marker as the name implies, this issue of the same IDs is maybe not that much of an issue.

However, back in the day when ADF usage was more prevalent but the dials were analog it would have been easier to tune the ADF to the wrong beacon.  
 
You gotta wonder...   

[NM8R]

P.V.,

For a few years I did engineering work for a small AM stick, and the owner of an FM outlet to the north heard of this and being the thrifty type he was, enlisted my help when his long time C.E. got fed up and walked.  The FM was a disaster.  Not b/c of the previous engineer, but due to the owner's cheapness. 

At any rate, I got to know some of the personalities and the young lady in one of the overnight slots was amusing.  This girl had an on-air persona as a non stop walking party diva.  But she confessed she disliked the music quite a bit and was actually classically trained.  Very smart young lady, too.

The MB NDB matter - looks like the Dep't of Ambiguity struck, hard.

171 very weak at this writing (0035Z).

Scott

[NM8R]

And off topic ramblings about CKLW would be quite welcome.  Besides, LW is poor right now. 

I figure the silent masses might like to hear, also. 

Scott